
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Free Software and Offshoring</title>
	<atom:link href="http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/</link>
	<description>Keeping politicians&#039; hands off the Net &#38; everything else related to technology</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 26 May 2012 17:40:49 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: eee_eff</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-50185</link>
		<dc:creator>eee_eff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 02:19:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-50185</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;Tim, I haven&#039;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#039;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Well you say that, but, as Tim points out you have said this:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;i&gt;However, in a globalized race to the bottom, it’s not a stretch to say that the EU would lose to even cheaper programmers in China, India and the former Soviet bloc. In the U.S., for example, the cost savings of IT offshoring in 2004 reached $7.0 billion, according to a study by ITAA — a 36.2% savings rate…&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;i&gt;By increasing demand for FLOSS through preferences and mandates, the EU will find that in a “Flat World”, lower cost developers from other countries would rush to fill that demand. The result is more likely to be an increase in offshoring to China and India—not job creation in the EU.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;which really sounds like you are trying to co-opt some of the know-nothing populist arguments against capitalism.  Don&#039;t get me wrong--there are plenty of things that need to be regulated and improved with capitalism as it is now operating--but this is just an argument against competitive markets, and if you take competition away from the market, you don&#039;t have a whole lot left.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Tim, I haven&#8217;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#8217;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.</i><br /><br />Well you say that, but, as Tim points out you have said this:<br /><br /><i>However, in a globalized race to the bottom, it’s not a stretch to say that the EU would lose to even cheaper programmers in China, India and the former Soviet bloc. In the U.S., for example, the cost savings of IT offshoring in 2004 reached $7.0 billion, according to a study by ITAA — a 36.2% savings rate…</i><br /><i>By increasing demand for FLOSS through preferences and mandates, the EU will find that in a “Flat World”, lower cost developers from other countries would rush to fill that demand. The result is more likely to be an increase in offshoring to China and India—not job creation in the EU.</i><br /><br />which really sounds like you are trying to co-opt some of the know-nothing populist arguments against capitalism.  Don&#8217;t get me wrong&#8211;there are plenty of things that need to be regulated and improved with capitalism as it is now operating&#8211;but this is just an argument against competitive markets, and if you take competition away from the market, you don&#8217;t have a whole lot left.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: enigma_foundry</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-38501</link>
		<dc:creator>enigma_foundry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2007 01:19:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-38501</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;Tim, I haven&#039;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#039;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Well you say that, but, as Tim points out you have said this:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;However, in a globalized race to the bottom, it’s not a stretch to say that the EU would lose to even cheaper programmers in China, India and the former Soviet bloc. In the U.S., for example, the cost savings of IT offshoring in 2004 reached $7.0 billion, according to a study by ITAA — a 36.2% savings rate…&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;By increasing demand for FLOSS through preferences and mandates, the EU will find that in a “Flat World”, lower cost developers from other countries would rush to fill that demand. The result is more likely to be an increase in offshoring to China and India—not job creation in the EU.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;which really sounds like you are trying to co-opt some of the know-nothing populist arguments against capitalism.  Don&#039;t get me wrong--there are plenty of things that need to be regulated and improved with capitalism as it is now operating--but this is just an argument against competitive markets, and if you take competition away from the market, you don&#039;t have a whole lot left.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Tim, I haven&#8217;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#8217;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.</i></p>

<p>Well you say that, but, as Tim points out you have said this:</p>

<p><i>However, in a globalized race to the bottom, it’s not a stretch to say that the EU would lose to even cheaper programmers in China, India and the former Soviet bloc. In the U.S., for example, the cost savings of IT offshoring in 2004 reached $7.0 billion, according to a study by ITAA — a 36.2% savings rate…</i></p>

<p><i>By increasing demand for FLOSS through preferences and mandates, the EU will find that in a “Flat World”, lower cost developers from other countries would rush to fill that demand. The result is more likely to be an increase in offshoring to China and India—not job creation in the EU.</i></p>

<p>which really sounds like you are trying to co-opt some of the know-nothing populist arguments against capitalism.  Don&#8217;t get me wrong&#8211;there are plenty of things that need to be regulated and improved with capitalism as it is now operating&#8211;but this is just an argument against competitive markets, and if you take competition away from the market, you don&#8217;t have a whole lot left.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tim Lee</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-50184</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 22:30:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-50184</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Braden, I&#039;m glad to hear I was misreading your piece, and I&#039;m sorry if I misrepresented your views.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Braden, I&#8217;m glad to hear I was misreading your piece, and I&#8217;m sorry if I misrepresented your views.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: bradencox</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-50183</link>
		<dc:creator>bradencox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 21:56:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-50183</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Let it be known that it was me that just posted the above comment (didn&#039;t mean to be anonymous).&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let it be known that it was me that just posted the above comment (didn&#8217;t mean to be anonymous).</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-50182</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 21:53:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-50182</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Tim, I haven&#039;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#039;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It was the authors of the study that asserted that free software programmers could be hired more cheaply, to the point that even SMEs would be able to hire programmers in-house. I didn&#039;t take issue with this (they could be wrong) but I was trying to provide the big picture conclusion to their analysis.&lt;br&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Smith &amp; Ricardo taught us that national welfare will be enhanced by focusing resources on comparative advantages. Offshoring is consistent with this, as is the offshoring of programmer jobs. As you say this could help the overall EU economy, but it seems to me that it would hurt the very ICT sector that the report&#039;s authors are promoting. And I&#039;ve heard that the EU is helping to train Chinese and Brazilian open source programmers through a recent R&amp;D; grant (if someone could help confirm/deny that would be helpful). Again, this program sounds good for international relations, is perhaps good for the EU as a whole, but sounds bad for FLOSS programmers who live in the EU.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim, I haven&#8217;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#8217;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.</p>

<p><br /></p>

<p>It was the authors of the study that asserted that free software programmers could be hired more cheaply, to the point that even SMEs would be able to hire programmers in-house. I didn&#8217;t take issue with this (they could be wrong) but I was trying to provide the big picture conclusion to their analysis.<br /></p>

<p>Smith &#038; Ricardo taught us that national welfare will be enhanced by focusing resources on comparative advantages. Offshoring is consistent with this, as is the offshoring of programmer jobs. As you say this could help the overall EU economy, but it seems to me that it would hurt the very ICT sector that the report&#8217;s authors are promoting. And I&#8217;ve heard that the EU is helping to train Chinese and Brazilian open source programmers through a recent R&#038;D; grant (if someone could help confirm/deny that would be helpful). Again, this program sounds good for international relations, is perhaps good for the EU as a whole, but sounds bad for FLOSS programmers who live in the EU.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tim Lee</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-38500</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 21:30:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-38500</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Braden, I&#039;m glad to hear I was misreading your piece, and I&#039;m sorry if I misrepresented your views.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Braden, I&#8217;m glad to hear I was misreading your piece, and I&#8217;m sorry if I misrepresented your views.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Braden</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-38499</link>
		<dc:creator>Braden</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 20:56:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-38499</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Let it be known that it was me that just posted the above comment (didn&#039;t mean to be anonymous).&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let it be known that it was me that just posted the above comment (didn&#8217;t mean to be anonymous).</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-38498</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 20:53:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-38498</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Tim, I haven&#039;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#039;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It was the authors of the study that asserted that free software programmers could be hired more cheaply, to the point that even SMEs would be able to hire programmers in-house. I didn&#039;t take issue with this (they could be wrong) but I was trying to provide the big picture conclusion to their analysis.
&lt;p&gt;Smith &amp; Ricardo taught us that national welfare will be enhanced by focusing resources on comparative advantages. Offshoring is consistent with this, as is the offshoring of programmer jobs. As you say this could help the overall EU economy, but it seems to me that it would hurt the very ICT sector that the report&#039;s authors are promoting. And I&#039;ve heard that the EU is helping to train Chinese and Brazilian open source programmers through a recent R&amp;D grant (if someone could help confirm/deny that would be helpful). Again, this program sounds good for international relations, is perhaps good for the EU as a whole, but sounds bad for FLOSS programmers who live in the EU.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim, I haven&#8217;t lost my free trade beliefs just yet! I agree with Mankiw (he was unfairly maligned for this statement, unfortunately) and Bartlett wholeheartedly. I just disagreed with the report&#8217;s assumption that a FLOSS-based industrial policy will create jobs in the EU.</p>

<p>It was the authors of the study that asserted that free software programmers could be hired more cheaply, to the point that even SMEs would be able to hire programmers in-house. I didn&#8217;t take issue with this (they could be wrong) but I was trying to provide the big picture conclusion to their analysis.
</p><p>Smith &#038; Ricardo taught us that national welfare will be enhanced by focusing resources on comparative advantages. Offshoring is consistent with this, as is the offshoring of programmer jobs. As you say this could help the overall EU economy, but it seems to me that it would hurt the very ICT sector that the report&#8217;s authors are promoting. And I&#8217;ve heard that the EU is helping to train Chinese and Brazilian open source programmers through a recent R&#038;D grant (if someone could help confirm/deny that would be helpful). Again, this program sounds good for international relations, is perhaps good for the EU as a whole, but sounds bad for FLOSS programmers who live in the EU.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jim Lippard</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-50181</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Lippard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 20:37:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-50181</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I recently came across a company that has a staff of programmers in Vietnam.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recently came across a company that has a staff of programmers in Vietnam.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jim Lippard</title>
		<link>http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/comment-page-1/#comment-38497</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Lippard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 19:37:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://techliberation.com/2007/06/05/free-software-and-offshoring/#comment-38497</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I recently came across a company that has a staff of programmers in Vietnam.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recently came across a company that has a staff of programmers in Vietnam.</p>]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

